TriDot Podcast .221

IRONMAN and TriDot: The Ultimate Partnership to Improve YourPreparation

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Intro: This is the TriDot podcast. TriDot uses yourtraining data and genetic profile, combined with predictive analytics andartificial intelligence to optimize your training, giving you better results inless time with fewer injuries. Our podcast is here to educate, inspire, andentertain. We’ll talk all things triathlon with expert coaches and specialguests. Join the conversation and let’s improve together.

Andrew Harley: Big episode of the TriDot podcast today! Thanks so much for joining us.I have two of triathlon’s, most influential CEOs with me, and we will betalking all about the new partnership between IRONMAN and TriDot, with bothcompanies working together to improve the athlete experience and preparing forraces. You guessed it, my first guest is Andrew Messick, the Chief ExecutiveOfficer of the World Triathlon Corporation. Andrew joined IRONMAN in 2011, andhis leadership has contributed to the growth of our sport and the globalexpansion of IRONMAN. He is an experienced road cyclist, mountain biker, andmarathoner. He is also a three-time IRONMAN finisher himself, who has alsoqualified for and raced in the IRONMAN 70.3 World. Championships. Andrew,welcome to the TriDot podcast!

Andrew Messick: Thanks Andrew, I'm very happy to be here.

Andrew Harley: I'm super curious, Andrew, when you raced theIRONMAN 70.3 World Championship, what location was it? What was the venue forthat one?

Andrew Messick: That was in Clearwater. I qualified in Cancun,and then raced Clearwater in 2006.

Andrew Harley: Very cool. I grew up in Lakeland, Florida, so we went to Clearwater allthe time. I had no idea 70.3 Worlds was there ever, so I learned somethingalready.

Andrew Messick: I PR’ed by 12 minutes, and still came in 100thin my age group.

Andrew Harley: I believe it, I absolutely believe that. I wouldbe well worse in my age group if I made that race. My second guest today isTriDot Founder and CEO, Jeff Booher. Jeff was the chief architect behindTriDot’s Training Optimization Technology, and he continues to pioneer inendurance sports tech.  He is a four-timeIRONMAN finisher, who has coached dozens of professional triathletes andnational champions, as well as hundreds of age-groupers, to podiums and PRssince he began coaching in 2003. Jeff, welcome back to the show!

Jeff Booher: Yeah, thanks! I'm super excited. This is a fun one. Just a privilege tobe on here with Andrew.

Andrew Harley: Andrew and Andrew. Yeah, the Andrews. I amAndrew the Average Triathlete, Voice of the People and Captain of the Middle ofthe Pack. As always, we'll roll through our warmup question, settle in for ourmain set conversation, and then wind things down with our Cooldown Tip of theWeek. Lots of good stuff, let's get to it!

Warm up theme: Time to warm up! Let’s get moving.

Andrew Harley:  There are few joys that compareto the elation of riding your bike on a nice road, on a nice day, in a supernice location.  And from Oceansidewinding roads to up and down mountain passes and everything in between, thereare plenty of top tier roads that belong on a triathlete’s “I want to bike ridethere” bucket list. Andrew, Jeff, as our TriDot podcast warmup question of theday, if you could hop off this podcast recording and go ride your bike on anyroad in the world, where would you most want to ride? Jeff Booher, over to youfirst.

Jeff Booher: Yes, sure. This has changed for me in the past 12 months.

Andrew Harley: Okay, sure!

Jeff Booher: Well, these past three months, probably.  We were in Nice, seeing that bike course,that was so amazing and epic. I didn't get to ride it while I was there, I wasso busy with other things.  But it wasbeautiful. I heard about it, I saw some of the footage of it, and I have to dothat. Bucket list, for sure.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, next time you travel there, if you want toborrow my bike travel bag, I will gladly let you take your bike so you canexperience that. Top-tier selection. I know our TriDot athletes who havealready qualified for Nice are packing their bags, booking their tickets, andvery excited to go race there again. We've heard a lot of great buzz about that course. Andrew Messick, ifyou could go ride your bike anywhere in the world after this podcast recording,where are you going?

Andrew Messick: Well, I'd like to say Santa Barbara County,because I live there and. I grew up there. But I think the Alps is really thebest place, and in particular, just outside of Zell am See in Austria. Theroads are fantastic. We had the 70.3 World Championship there in 2015, andthose beautiful climbs, the beautiful descents, the quality of the roads, justperfect.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, that's great to have your personalendorsement of that, that is a race on my short list to travel overseas and do.I would love to do that race. Longtime listeners of our podcast know I love thegood race-cation, Andrew.  I lovetraveling for a race, and that one is on my short list, so it’s good to haveyour endorsement of it. This pick for me – our own personal staff member,TriDot podcast regular Dr. BJ Leeper, has talked up the going to the Sun Roadin Glacier National Park in Montana. It's a road that just winds you throughGlacier National Park, through the countryside, up and down some of themountains.  Wild scenery, beautiful,stunning stuff, and probably more helpful, that road is actually closed tovehicle traffic for a certain portion of the summer. So it's a big spot forcyclists to get out there on their bikes, and not worry about cars, and goenjoy that road. It's 49.71 miles, which is like my ideal distance and durationfor a bike ride.  After about 49.71miles, I'm ready to get my butt off of a saddle. So that is the pick for me.

Guys,we're going to throw this question out to you, our audience, like we alwaysdo.  Make sure you're a part of the I AM TriDot Facebook group,where every single Monday when the new podcast episode drops, I pose thewarrant question to you, our audience. Can't wait to see what you have to sayon this one – if you could ride your bike anywhere in the world, any stretch ofroad, where are you going for a ride? Let us know.

Main set theme: On to the main set. Going in 3…2…1…

Andrew:  TriDot Pool School is the best way fortriathletes to learn proper swim form. The TriDot coaching team spent years on the pool deck, craftingfunctional freestyle, and it has already helped hundreds of triathletes improvetheir swim by an average of 12%. As soon as an athlete registers for TriDotPool School, they are given access to the TriDot Academy, where a series ofdry-land exercises help build crucial muscle memory, long before the in-personweekend. The weekend workshop is an engaging blend of instruction,demonstrations, and drills, with frequent breaks to rest and reflect. You'll begrouped with swimmers of similar ability, and taught step-by-step how to turnyour muscle memory into full-stroke swimming that's smooth and fast. TriDot PoolSchool is for everyone. We've had entry-level triathletes, back-of-the-packers,mid-packers, some elite age-groupers, and even a couple of pro triathletesattend.  Ready to jump in? There are PoolSchools available all over the country and around the world. Head to tridot.com/pool-school and sign up today.

Ibasically have been wearing some form of a TriDot hat and IRONMAN shirt or viceversa every day since the TriDot and IRONMAN partnership was announced. TodayI'm doing a TriDot polo and an IRONMAN Kona hat, that was my souvenir fromKona. As an athlete, I love both of these brands, I have plenty of merch witheach logo.  So yeah, I am thrilled tohave the IRONMAN and TriDot CEOs with me to talk about the future of triathlontraining and racing.  Now, Andrew, youwere a triathlete yourself well before you became CEO of the World TriathlonCorporation. You are a three-time IRONMAN finisher, and like we talked about,you raced the IRONMAN 70.3 World Championships in Clearwater. From your time asan athlete, what was your most meaningful or memorable moment on the IRONMANrace course?

Andrew Messick: I think I'm not uncommon in that my firstIRONMAN finish, which was in Penticton, British Columbia at IRONMAN Canada in2005, has a real special resonance. Because like for a lot of athletes, when you sign up for an IRONMAN,when you train for an IRONMAN, when you go get on the start line of an IRONMAN,you are throwing yourself into the unknown in a way that, a year or 18 monthsbefore, you'd never even contemplated. So to fight my way through that race – Ihad some health issues, I’d broken my arm the prior week –

Andrew Harley: The prior week?  The week before?

Andrew Messick: Yeah, the week before.  So the swim was uncomfortable.  But to fight my way through that race, andget to the finish line, I think was a really meaningful moment.  Because in every Ironman, and for everyathlete, you fight your way, and have to problem-solve your way through a longday.  So I think that particular onestands out.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, we go to the races all the time in support of our TriDotathletes, and I’m always reminded, Andrew, how even for our veterans, even forour 12, 13, 20-time IRONMAN, when they toe the line at another race, thatfinish line is never guaranteed.  Youalways have to work hard for it, you always have to battle through the event toget to it, to get through it. It's part of what makes it such a rewardingjourney. So I had no idea that was in your background of your first race, socongrats a couple years late, a belated congratulations on finishing that race.What were your other two after, Penticton?

Andrew Messick: I did Ironman Placid the year after that, thenI did Tremblant in 2012. And then actually, I've done four. I did Placid againin 2018.

Andrew Harley: Well, then you, sir, need to update your bio onthe IRONMAN website, because it still says three. You're short-changingyourself, Andrew Messick! You’re short-changing yourself. I've just got the onepersonally. Now Andrew, you transitioned from age-group triathlete to CEO in2011, and in your post at the helm of IRONMAN, you have seen just remarkablegrowth in the sport. You've seen some really cool changes and evolutions forthe sport in the way we go to the races and conquer the races.  From your time as CEO, what milestone for theIRONMAN group are you the most proud of?

Andrew Messick: Well, I think we've done a lot to make IRONMANmore accessible to athletes around the world. And part of that has been an expansion of the number of races.  Under my watch, we put a lot more races inAsia, a lot more races in the Middle East, a lot more races in Eastern Europe,a lot more races in Latin America. And we've seen the triathlon community inall of those places grow dramatically. And now, when you go to one of our World Championships, it is adramatically more global event. You hear more languages, you see teams ofpeople from literally all over the world. And that's really rewarding and really satisfying to see what started asthis very unique, specific thing in 1978 in Hawaii, turned into truly a globalphenomenon. And I think that the team has done a lot to make IRONMAN andIRONMAN 70.3 races available to athletes closer to where they live. We've donea lot over the years in trying to help our athletes be prepared for theirraces, and to make our races as good as we can, and as safe as we can.  And the continuation of that journey isreally what brings us here today. How do we make our races better, and how dowe help our athletes have their best day? But I think that really – if I was goingto summarize one thing that I think we've done really well, it's we've lookedafter our athletes, and made IRONMAN and IRONMAN 70.3 races available all overthe world for them.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, and that's on display when you go to theWorld Championships.  You go to theParade of Nations, and just the number of countries represented is staggering.It's beautiful to see, frankly.  You goto the welcome banquet, and on the screen before the welcome banquet starts,they'll highlight which countries have how many participants.  And as an athlete, when you're on the course,when you race in other countries, just hearing different languages, seeing thecountry flag of that athlete on their bib at certain races, very, verycool.  And so very cool to hear that'syour personal reflection from your time as CEO. Now Jeff for you, we have acouple of times on the podcast reflected on your own racing career, but a lotof that was something like 200 episodes ago. So in a conversation about howTriDot and IRONMAN are working together to shape the future of triathlontraining, just for some context on your own personal journey with the sport,can you give us the back story, your origin story as a triathlete, fromordinary triathlete to triathlete obsessed with optimizing training?

Jeff Booher: Yeah. Well, I got started in the sport of sprint triathlon, 20, 22years ago? Loved it. I'd always been athletic, doing all this stuff, but now ayoung 30-something dad – actually, Andrew’s story was great, they make IRONMANaccessible to everyone all over the world. My origin story is a little bit moreselfish than that. I wanted to make it more accessible to me. I wanted to becompetitive, but not have to train as much as everyone else seemed to betraining, these number of hours.  So itreally just started from my background in engineering information technology,putting together a system, or a way that I could train better, and justlearning. I loved it, I loved the sport, I loved everything about the sport, sojust the science of physiology and using data to do that, and it took severalyears before it really had an application beyond just me. People startedhearing what I was doing, and training buddies started using the training, andit grew from dozens, to hundreds, and one thing led to another and then here weare.  Many, many years later, I get theidea and the concept to where I can share this with a lot more people – othercoaches, other athletes – and make it more accessible in a training way.  Where you can go perform well, stayinjury-free, and be able to live this lifestyle as a triathlete.  And it could still be an extreme event, butit doesn't have to be excessive. It can be this epic huge thing, but it doesn'thave to be in excess where you have to give up everything else. So maybeapproaching it a little different way than Andrew, but making that highperformance possible while you still maintain the rest of your life.

Andrew Harley: So Jeff, now that we know Andrew is a four-timeIRONMAN finisher, you guys have something additional in common, because you area four-time IRONMAN finisher, is that correct?

Jeff Booher: I am, same, and I did one of them twice, so very similar.  I did Arizona twice.

Andrew Messick: Nice!

Andrew Harley: Is your best, most meaningful memory also yourfirst full-distance IRONMAN finish?

Jeff Booher: It is funny, I was smiling when Andrew was talking.  I actually crashed my bike and broke a coupleof ribs about 5 weeks before.  So I wasout of it, I couldn't run at all for several weeks.

Andrew Harley: Guys! Wow. Get it together, guys!

Jeff Booher: So it was literally one of those where I was up to the day, “If I getmy long run of at least 18 miles on this week, I'll go for it. Otherwise, I'mnot going to be prepared.” I ended up doing it, and I did okay – around 12hours on the first one.  It was CoeurD’Alene, a beautiful course. Loved it, it was just kind of sobering. You lookaround and go, “Oh, yeah, I'm racing. I gotta –“, such beautiful scenery. Soyeah, it was a great experience, that was 2007.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, my first IRONMAN event was half IRONMANNew Zealand.  And a unique thing aboutthat race, and Andrew knows this, is the half and the full run on the sameday.  So I finished the half, I wasabsolutely wiped, went back to the hotel, took a nap, my wife and I got somedinner, and then went back to the finish line and watched the full-distanceathletes come across the finish. It was so cool, I remember where I wasstanding there in Taupo, New Zealand, in the field by the finish line. You'rewatching athlete after athlete come through, and just the look on their faces,you could tell that the finish-line experience they were having was just onestep deeper, one step more fulfilling, one step more meaningful, than what Ihad experienced, which had plenty of emotions six hours prior.  That was kind of like the, “Man, I've got todo one of these. I've got to circle back and do a full.” So it makes sense tome that for both of you, your first full-distance IRONMAN triathlon is thatmeaningful moment for you.

Sowe all know that properly preparing for an IRONMAN event is a crucial part ofhaving a good day out on the course. So Andrew, when it comes to empoweringIRONMAN athletes with the right tools to get ready for race day, what madeTriDot the perfect partner for IRONMAN?

Andrew Messick: Let me start by going all the way to thebeginning. One of the things that I put a very serious emphasis on over mytenure at IRONMAN, is the experience of our athletes.  When you're talking to people within our company,you hear the term “athlete experience” a lot. That athlete experience,operationally, is defined by swim safety assets, by athlete food, by the numberof volunteers, by the amount of ice on the run course – all of those sort ofphysical touch points. But athlete experience, and creating a great experiencefor our athletes, is really quite a bit broader than that. And we've known fora long time that one of the ways for athletes to have a great day is for themto be fully prepared when they get to the start line, and to be as ready asthey can be. If they are as ready as they can be, they're more likely to have agood day, more likely to fulfill their goals. They're more likely to walk away from the experience feeling as positiveas they can be. And one of the unsolved problems that we've had for the firstdozen years of my tenure is, how do we help our athletes in that journey? So aswe've evolved, and gotten to know Jeff and the TriDot team better, we realizedthat really there is a critical athlete experience role around the preparationof our athletes, around making sure that they are as ready as they can be, thatthey have done it in a way that is as balanced as it can be, and that theracing and the training isn't putting undue stress on other aspects of theirlives, because all of us are balancing all the time.

Andrew Harley: Yeah.

Andrew Messick: And really we felt that this partnership hasthe potential to take a really enormous step forward in terms of how ourathletes prepare themselves, so that when they get to the start line, they areas balanced, as squared away as they can be, and have the highest likelihood ofachieving their goals when they race. And that fits very well with our “truenorth” of great experiences for our athletes.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, that's a great “true north”. As an athlete, when you show up to the races, it absolutely shows howathlete-experience-focused IRONMAN is, because the experience from start tofinish is top-notch the entire way through the process. And I know TriDot isvery excited to be a part of that moving forward.  I will tell you both of you guys though,besides just being prepared and trained correctly, I think another thing thatreally helps you have a great day on course is not breaking bones going intothe race.  For both of you – was yoursecond IRONMAN a little bit easier without a broken arm, Andrew?

Andrew Messick: It was! My swim time was quite substantiallyfaster.

Andrew Harley: A little different – “Man, I got so much better!Man, my training is going great!”

Andrew Messick: I could swim in a straight line!

Andrew Harley: Yeah! So when this partnership was announced, there was all sorts ofbuzz on social media and just in the triathlon sphere. And there was somethingthat Mike Reilly posted that I absolutely loved, he posted on Instagram talkingabout this partnership. He has ties to both of our brands, and he saidsomething along the lines of, “IRONMAN and TriDot fitting together as perfectlyas two companies possibly could. It works so well because training just goes sohand-in-hand with racing.” We are experts in training, IRONMAN is expert atputting on a great race experience. I'm curious from the two of you, since thenews went out, what comments and feedback have you guys seen and taken note offrom the triathlon industry?

Jeff Booher: Well, I'll start. I've seen just quite a bit of positive stuff, we'rejust so excited. I think as a more innovative pioneer in the technology space,there's a lot of coaches and athletes over the years who have kind of steppedout into something bold and different, accept and embrace change, and have beena part of that change, have contributed to our technology and to so many thingsthat we're doing and building.  It's verygratifying. It feels like a team celebration – athletes, ambassadors, coaches,so many people are just jumping up and down excited, having invested so much inour community and our technology.  To beable to share that, bring that to more people, it's just been a greatcelebration.

Andrew Harley: Yeah. And we certainly see what a lot of ourcurrent athletes and our current coaches are saying and feeling.  Andrew, you guys have touch points with somany different brands and athletes aside from TriDot, what's the buzz and thereaction that you guys have seen?

Andrew Messick: I think it's very positive.  It's very positive because I think it showsour commitment to putting the best tools and the best types of products infront of our athletes, to give them their best chance to have their best day. Ithink that there's a role for us to play in helping our athletes succeed inthat part of their journey, and we want to play there.  We want to be more active in how to make yourathletes succeed and make them successful.

Andrew Harley: Since this announcement went out, I think a bigquestion I've seen from athletes in the community – both TriDot and non-TriDot– is what does this partnership mean for athletes? So guys, what tools and whatresources, what will athletes start to see based on this partnership? Jeff?

Jeff Booher: Yeah, several things.  We'vecontemplated quite a bit and have several things already working with morecontent – more educational content, inspirational content, venue-specificcontent in the app, kind of on a just-in-time basis as you're training andpreparing.  There's a lot more that wecan do collaboratively with coaches and Pool School, and bringing that to morepeople as we have the scale. We're able to offer it closer and in morecommunities, so it makes it easier, more accessible to learn how to swim,swimming being a big barrier for athletes. And there's a lot of things beyond that. We've had many things thatwe've been talking about leading up to the announcement, but it's been soexciting to work with the team more. They're at IRONMAN, and they have so manyother ideas, and it just feels like there's an endless number of things.  Like Andrew mentioned, them producing theraces, but wanting to be a part of that preparation. There's so many thingsthat they see, their team season has experienced, that we can learn from andbring. So we're excited to bring our ideas and things that we can do, andfigure out how to put the best of all that together just for that ultimateexperience.

Andrew Harley: Andrew, from just the IRONMAN group side, as youlook at this partnership, what are you hoping that athletes tangibly see andtangibly benefit from out of this partnership?

Andrew Messick: Well, I think there's two broad categorieswhere I think we have real potential. One of them, as we think about PoolSchools and the whole swim side of the partnership – one of the major gatingissues in the sport of triathlon is swimming. And to the extent that we cancollectively de-stress the swim even more, and find ways where people can gainmore comfort, they can take this leap and go from being a cyclist or a runnerand be a triathlete.  That the swimmingpart is just a little more straightforward, a little less scary, that peoplecan say like, “I know what to do to get myself ready to be able to handle anopen-water swim in a triathlon.” I think that part helps bring more people intothe sport, and we're hopeful about that. The second thing really relates to alot of the technology that Jeff and his team have developed around trainingsmarter, not harder. Again, one of the things that we hear in particular fromour IRONMAN athletes is that they have discomfort around how much they need totrain in order to feel prepared for a race, especially a full-distance IRONMAN.And to the extent that that we can help our athletes find ways to be able totrain more efficiently, and be able to get the training benefits withoutnecessarily all of the hours, we think it's more likely that people will stayin the lifestyle, and that they will find that they're not having to makeunmanageable trade-offs between work and family, the rest of their personallives, and racing. If we're able to do that, people are going to stick around.So part of this is helping to expand the funnel, part of this is keeping peoplein our ecosystem longer, and we're really quite optimistic about both of them.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, healthy athletes are happy athletes,right? That's certainly the case for me, I'm always happiest when I'mhealthiest, and TriDot has certainly helped with that over my own triathlonjourney. I'm curious for you, Andrew, when you were racing IRONMAN-distanceraces, what did your own training look like? What were you doing in your swim,bike, and run to prepare for those races?

Andrew Messick: You know, I trained 20 hours a week, and itjust killed me. I got up at 4:00 in the morning, I went to sleep at 9:00.  We had no friends, we never went out todinner.  We never went anywhere on theweekend because I did my five-hour bike ride on Saturday and I did my 14-milerun on Sunday.  The training and thepreparation sort of blotted out the sun. As I've gotten older, I've learned howto be really quite race-fit in less than half of that amount of time. And tothe extent that we can help people with that, I think the benefits are reallyprofound.

Andrew Harley: Jeff, something you've shared before is that youwere the original TriDot athlete.  Youstarted all this because you were motivated to improve and optimize your owntraining.  So from when you first startedracing in the sport, and you kind of refined it, studied, you learned, what didyour own evolution in your personal training look like that led to the foundingof TriDot?

Jeff Booher: It was just being the guinea pig, but having training partners thatwere working with me was kind of fun. I've never really trained more than 12hours in a week, ever. That was kind of a hard line for me.  I just wanted to do well, wanted to compete.And you know, short-course is super easy, I could go out any given day and do,for me, just as good as I wanted to do, and continue to PR and continue to getfaster. One of the things that really appealed to me in the sport was, if youtrain right and well, you can keep getting faster and faster, on into your late50s and even late 60s depending on that. We have many, many athletes in theirlate 60s that are faster than when they were in their 40s. There's not manysports where you can do that. I know corporate softball teams or differentthings, you start pulling muscles, you start getting hurt, and you can't keepup with the young guys or gals. But in this sport, if you train right and well,and you’re disciplined and consistent, and you're doing the right trainingright, you can just keep getting better. I really liked that aspect of it,being able to get into the 40s and 50s and being able to do well and keepgetting better.  There's a psychology tothat, where you don't get older, you just start to feel like you're gettingslower. I've heard a great way of phrasing it – one of our athletes is late 50sand he goes, “I just love TriDot, because my performance improvement isoutpacing my aging.” So he's getting faster and faster as he's gettingolder.  It was just really cool the wayhe said it, just the smile.  He goes,“I've never had that.” I guess a year and a half he’s been using TriDot, he andhis girlfriend as well, and for both of them it's the longest time they've everbeen injury free.  And he goes, “It’sjust awesome, we just keep doing the sport we love. We don't have to take timeoff, we don't have to rehab and all these things.” That was it for me, justbeing able to kind of set that hard limit, and pushing against that, and tryingto get more and more efficient, and then delivering that same thing fortraining partners, friends. And then as the family grew, we just expanded it.

Andrew Harley: And I'll tell you, Jeff, I'm 35 at the time ofthis podcast recording.  I've done one140.6-mile full-distance IRONMAN race and hope to have another one in thefuture, and just hearing those stories, and knowing that my best personal daysof racing should be ahead of me if I keep doing the right training right, isreally encouraging for me to hear, as a 35-year-old hoping to do this sport foryears and years and years to come. Jeff, something I've seen asked on socialmedia, obviously in this partnership we would love for more athletes to findTriDot, start training with TriDot, and jump into our community. But for theathletes already there – for the athletes already doing the training, alreadyestablished, plugged into our community – are there any changes or anything newcoming down the pipeline that they should be expecting or get excited about?

Jeff Booher: I already mentioned a few things with the content and the preparationcomponents. There's a lot I get excited about just anytime a company, asoftware company especially – as you scale and reach bigger and biggeraudiences, you're able to grow your bandwidth, and so your road mapaccelerates. So there's so many things in our backlog of features, and evendifferent angles on the efficiency of the training that we're just so excitedabout. I don't want to tease that to set any expectations yet, but we knowexactly what they are.  Actually, rightafter this podcast, I have a meeting on roadmap prioritization. That's one ofthe things that's been super exciting, we have a bunch of things that we'regoing to be able to do and get to faster for the athletes. Yeah, that's whatI'm most excited about.  

Andrew Harley: I want to move on to triathlon coaching a littlebit.  Because one thing with TriDot andIRONMAN both is we believe in coaches, we believe in the power andeffectiveness of coaches. We want to empower coaches to coach their athletes aseffectively as possible. That's part of athletes having a great day at theraces, is having a good coach in their corner. So what does this partnership mean for triathlon coaches? Andrew?

Andrew Messick: I think it's really positive. A lot of ourathletes use coaches, they use them around the world. And our belief is thatcoaches in general make you perform better. When you look at elite athletes,does any elite athlete say, “Well, I'm now good enough so that I don't need acoach”? That's one thing you never hear. So connecting our athletes with peoplewho can help them improve their performance really matters. Again, to be ableto link that with tools and technology that enable those coaches to be as goodas they can possibly be is a giant step forward for us.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, you can use TriDot training with orwithout a coach.  For me personally, whenI found TriDot, it was partially because I wanted a coach, but at the time ofmy life I couldn't afford the price tag that usually comes with propercoaching. I will say, triathlon coaches do a lot for you. They deserve the ratethat they charge, absolutely. Just at that time in my life I couldn't affordit, so I found TriDot, and the training is phenomenal. It's amazing. I wasgetting faster, I was getting fitter, I was staying healthy, and over time Iwas able to add a TriDot coach in my corner. Definitely the baseline of the training is still there, the same greatoptimized training is still helping me each and every day when I fire up theapp and do my training.  But just havinga coach – to keep me accountable, bounce ideas off of, talk me through my raceprep, talk me through how I'm executing certain training sessions – has justbeen invaluable. So Jeff, I know it's something TriDot believes in. Can you speakto this as well, what coaches can expect to see with TriDot coming in withIRONMAN?

Jeff Booher: Yeah, it's a lot more than just something that we believe in. We'venever not had coaches.  When we first gotstarted it was coaches only, with the tool, the platform.  It was several years into it when we ever hada non-coached option, in realizing that 85% of the market doesn't hire acoach.  For whatever reason, budget,whatever –

Andrew Harley: Most triathletes. Yeah, a large majority.

Jeff Booher: Yeah. But that other 15%, even on our own platform – here we have thisAI-augmented intelligence engine that does the technology piece – we still havethat same background.  Of our ownsubscribers, about 15% – within a percent or two every year – hire acoach.  And what they find is that theefficiency in the technology, just like pilots and physicians and mechanics,all of these different professions that have high-tech tools that they use,whether it's AI or other kinds of technology – they're able to be moreefficient, better, deliver higher service to their athletes.  And for coaches, that means they have moretime to actually coach and do the human side of coaching, working with thepsychological and emotional side, building rapport and relationship.  AI technology will never replace a human inthat regard, in the human-to-human, and that's what athletes value themost.  They can push their athletes, holdthem accountable, there's just so many different things. So we've seen so muchbetter productivity results from that coach relationship, and our coaches willkeep their athletes a lot longer, just because they have thatrelationship.  They can hear things,they're not heads-down in a spreadsheet or looking through data, doing thingsthat technology was designed to do. So we've seen just so much value inbringing the human side back to that relationship, and it’s more viable forcoaches. They can build a business, they can scale their business, they canbuild a community of teams and focus more on that, when they’ve kind of had toneglect that just out of necessity in doing the training plans manually.

Andrew Harley: I will say, Jeff, going to a lot of the races for TriDot, we haveplenty of TriDot athletes succeed at the IRONMAN level without having a coach,they're just using the training on their own. But I think it's no coincidencethat most of our athletes that do exceptionally well, that find themselves onthe podium, find themselves qualifying for World Championships, find themselvesearning their pro cards – more often than not, those athletes have a TriDot orIRONMAN-certified coach.  I don't thinkthat's by accident, and I'm excited to see just how many more people can find aquality coach through this partnership myself.

Jeff Booher: I want to point out one thing you said about a TriDot coach.  Internally we say a TriDot coach is just acoach that uses TriDot. But coaches have their own brand, their own teams,their own clubs, their own name, their own pricing, their own everything. Weare that platform that they use, we're a tool that they use. I don't want thatto come across as if they're working for us or anything like that. It's notthat, it's a collective environment and community. We work together andcollaborate, but they’re all independent, doing their own flair, their ownvibe, in their own communities.

Andrew Harley: Yes. Yeah, and I love it when Coach MichelleJones – who's an IRONMAN commentator at the races, an IRONMAN World Champion –she is Giddy Up Coaching. Amazing branding, and really, really fun. Kids, Iwould love to join Giddy Up Coaching just to wear one of Michelle's kits,they're fantastic.  Just seeing how eachcoach goes about building their business, and branding themselves, and formingtheir own athlete community is super fun. And I know IRONMAN backs that, IRONMAN is proud of that, and TriDot ishappy to be part of it as well.

Bothof you have already mentioned Pool School a number of times, and I want to makesure – our regular listeners are already well versed in what TriDot Pool Schoolis. We have a lot of TriDot Ambassadors, TriDot coaches, IRONMAN athletes whohave gone through TriDot Pool School, seeing a huge impact on their swim. ButJeff, for anybody who's coming to this conversation, wanting to hear the two ofyou talk about the partnership, but they're not super familiar with what TriDotPool School is, can you just give us an overview of this program, why it'spartnering with IRONMAN, and the difference it can make for an athlete?

Jeff Booher: Absolutely. Super-quick overview, we’ve noticed forever that the swimis a barrier of entry. It's one of those gating things. Even with the 60million runners and 50 million cyclists, they don't want to come in and suck atthe swim. They want to be good.  They'recompetitors, they want to do well, they want to see a path to competence andsuccess. So we just kind of pooled together – haha, no pun intended – we pooledtogether our knowledge, came up with a program to teach very efficiently. So there'ssome at-home study through videos, so you're learning the muscle memory at homebefore you come to a weekend. Then over the weekend it's two four-hour sessionson a Saturday or Sunday typically. And the way that we teach it is veryinnovative. It's flaw resistance, so you learn a way that you hold, and youdon't compensate. It's a ground-up approach, you're not just compensating,where it's going to go away.  We've justseen huge results. On average, 12½ percent improvement across the board. It'sjust phenomenal gains.  A lot of peoplehave had separate swim coaches, and programs, and clinics, and worked for yearsto drop 3, 4, 5, 6 seconds, then we'll see them drop 20 seconds in the weekend.Just these staggering results, people in tears, literally shouting andjoy.  It's crazy the kind of results thatthey get, just the breakthrough, and it just makes for such a better raceexperience. I've had multiple people come up to me on the Friday before westart and literally say, “Jeff, if I don't get substantially better, I'mquitting the sport of triathlon. I'm out. I'm tired of passing a thousandpeople on the bike and run, just to miss the podium.” And they come in, and oneof those guys went from a 2:05 hundred pace to a 1:30 in one weekend. That justchanges your day, it changes everything. And that's just the starting point. Wehave all the way down to 50-second 100’s athletes coming in and taking 2, 3, 4seconds off, at all levels. So to be able to bring that consistency, and thenbring it in an environment where coaches all over can collaborate and workthrough that methodology, and we just put it on in a place where local teams ofcoaches are delivering that – cities across the US, we’ll launch one in Spain,we have it going on in London as well. And we'll look to scale that through the coaches, and bring thatmethodology to coaches around the world.

Andrew Harley: Yeah, I've seen it with my own eyes. I've beenon deck with the camera, just getting some pictures and video clips andcheering athletes on.  I've yet to get inthe water myself, and I certainly need to. Because I feel great about my run, I feel good about my bike, but if youdon't have that background of being a swimmer when you come to triathlon, ittakes proper coaching to really get faster. You can do the workouts, and you get a little bit faster and a littlebit faster, but these breakthroughs happen when you actually get the formright, when you have somebody really with their eyes on you, helping you get itright. So I'm excited to see more people get in the water. Andrew Messick, canwe expect to see you at a TriDot Pool School at any point in time? Are youstill planning on racing yourself again, to need to improve your swim?

Andrew Messick: Well, I'm registered for the IRONMAN WorldChampionships in October, and the 70.3 World Championships in December. So I'vegot work to do.

Jeff Booher:  There you go!

Andrew Harley: Heeey! Alright, we'll see you there! Couple more questions, guys, in ourconversation here. I just want to say, just personally, working with the teambehind the scenes at IRONMAN has already been a blast. Andrew, I found yourteam to be incredibly collaborative and positive about the direction that allof this is heading.  There's a great dealof talent, passion, and resources on both sides – from IRONMAN and TriDot – onevery single one of our calls. Andrew, Jeff, can you both just speak to thebuzz in both offices when it comes to the work that's already being done onsome 2024 initiatives between our brands? Andrew, what are people saying inTampa, Florida, about what's coming up with TriDot and IRONMAN?

Andrew Messick: I think people are really excited.  They're excited because we have new tools tobe able to help our athletes succeed with. For an organization that really is hyper-focused on athlete experienceand the success of our athletes, being able to have a partner that canmaterially help that, is just super-motivating for all of us.

Andrew Harley: Jeff, on all of our Microsoft Teams work calls,what's the buzz on Team TriDot when it comes to the things we're alreadyworking on with this partnership?

Jeff Booher: Yeah, well, you were there for most of them, hearing that report outevery day. It's just the excitement coming back after the calls and just beingso appreciative that the guys at IRONMAN are just as passionate about this.They care just as much about the athletes, are just as committed to quality,all of those same things.  It feels likekindred spirits, we're all in this together. Then just the openness, thehumility to be able to work together, listen to each other’s ideas andinnovate, and the openness to the discussions, has just been reallyinvigorating. A lot of energy there, a lot of potential.  I know we're just kind of doing the firststeps, in the first month or so, but there's just so much more potential outthere.

Andrew Harley: Well, guys, before we sign off on this podcastrecording, I just want to compliment you both, as an athlete who benefits fromhow passionate both brains are about the sport. Jeff, working for TriDot, I know first-hand how passionate you are abouttriathlon and all the athletes who participate at every level, sprint up toIRONMAN. Andrew, I've heard you speak a number of times at different events,and see just how deeply you love the sport, and how deeply you love theage-groupers, how deeply you love the professionals lining up, it just shinesthrough every single time you present. So I just want to end today with a briefreflection from you both. As our companies plan to work together for a longtime on improving that athlete experience, what do you hope the triathlonexperience looks like for athletes five to ten years from now? Andrew?

Andrew Messick: I hope that we've taken a step forward inmaking our athletes feel comfortable about our sport, particularly comfortableabout getting in the water and being able to start their race with confidenceand with a bit of swagger. And that more of them will say, “This lifestyle thatI'm leading, where fitness is a big part of it, where I'm healthy, I'm chasingambitious new goals – I can do that for a long time, and still be the parentand spouse and community member that I want to be.  All these things can happen at the sametime.” Five years from now, if we can get there, that'll be awesome.

Andrew Harley: Jeff Booher, same question to you.

Jeff Booher: Yeah, I'd jump in with exactly the same answer, is just making thatmore accessible for those that are in it. And I think making that commonknowledge to people outside the sport that, “I can do that.  It’s extreme, but it's not excessive.” It's areally cool thing, it's a big epic event, and having them see a pathway, andfewer barriers – all the cyclists and runners and people that want thatchallenge, want that variety of workouts. That's one of the things I loved whenI first got started. It's something different, every course is different.  Swim, bike, and run, it's never themonotonous same thing, single sport. So if we can make just the general publicknow, that wants to stay healthy and have an active lifestyle, and have awonderful community of people that are just out there setting the ambitiousgoals and going after them – I think if we can bring that to more people, thenthat's a huge success.

Andrew Harley: So Jeff, Andrew has IRONMAN number five in 2024on the books with the World Championships. Can we expect to see you at theraces anytime soon?

Jeff Booher: I don't have anything penciled in, but my kids are trying to put somepressure on me. I think they want one of those race-cations, and they thinkI'll pay if we all register together. So we'll have something on the schedulebefore long.

Andrew Harley: Andrew, what race should the Booher family do arace-cation to? What's your personal recommendation?

Andrew Messick: Well, we have choices, it depends on when youwant to do it. We've got some great races in Europe in the summertime, we'vegot some great races all over the world in the autumn.  And if you're thinking family, we've got thislittle 70.3 World Championship in New Zealand in December. Who doesn't want togo to New Zealand?

Jeff Booher: Yeah, that's tempting.  I thinkI'm going to be there for sure.

Andrew Messick: Maybe we'll race on Sunday.

Jeff Booher: Uh oh, is that a challenge? I don't know.

Andrew Harley: But we're not in the same age group, we’ll startat different times.

Jeff Booher: We can equalize for that, we have the technology.  We can take care of that.

Andrew Messick: Fair enough.

Cool down theme: Great set everyone! Let’s cool down.

Andrew Harley: Well, we always close the show with a coachtriathlon tip. Now we usually bring on a different coach to wow us with somecoaching wisdom and insight. But with Andrew Messick on the show today, Ithought I would keep him on a little bit longer and see what we can learn fromhim. So Andrew, to close out our show today, straight from the CEO's desk, whatis one IRONMAN training or racing tip that you can share with our athleteslistening today?

Andrew Messick: I tell all but the very most experienced peoplethat you should think about the first four buoys of the swim as a warmup.  Just don't get stressed, don't try to catchfeet. Get loose, get your breathing organized, get warm, and if you want toaccelerate after that, feel free. But don't burn any matches early.

Outro:Thanks for joining us. Make sure to subscribe and share the TriDot podcast withyour triathlon crew. For more great tri content and community, connect with uson Facebook, YouTube, and Instagram. Ready to optimize your training? Head totridot.com and start your free trial today! TriDot – the obvious and automaticchoice for triathlon training.

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